The largest Civic Type R club forum

[andy18s]

If you plan on using the standard internals then yes, there will be a large power difference.

k24a1 is 160hp vs the 200hp of the k24a3
k24a1 has weaker conrods and lower compression pistons hence the lower power figure and lower rev limit.

Essentially the k24a1 block is near identical to the k24a3 so if you plan on building the engine, it wouldn't make a difference which one you use.

My advice is find a really low mileage complete A3, fit k20 head and oil pump, crank pulley, sump etc.

At least with the complete engine you'll have less parts to source as you'll be using the k24 timing chain, timing chain guides, timing chain cover etc to make the swap easier. The k24 goodies like waterpump, alternator, starter motor etc are all interchangeable so you'll have lots of spares which you could sell off or save for a rainy day.

Decide if you want to go for the high revving built route or if you want the lower revving (7800) oem reliability :thumbup:

[phunkmasterd]

sorry i got my engine codes wrong...i want an A2

K24A2
Found in:
2004-2008 Acura TSX, JDM CL9 Accord Type-S, RB1 Odyssey Absolute
Displacement: 2,354 cc (143.6 cu in)
Power: 200 PS (150 kW; 200 hp) @ 6800 rpm
Torque: 232 N·m (171 lb·ft) @ 4500 rpm (166 lbft @ 4500 rpm U.S.)
Bore: 87 mm
Stroke: 99 mm
Compression: 10.5:1
Redline:
Automatic 7100 rpm
Sequential Sportshift 7300 rpm (7100 rpm U.S.)
Manual 7600 rpm (7100 rpm U.S.)


Note: The 2006-2008 K24A2 in the U.S. market Acura TSX has the following improvements[2]
Power: 205 hp @ 7000 rpm
Torque: 164 lbft @ 4500 rpm
Increased intake flow:
Intake valve + 1 mm oversize
Intake cam High lift lobe with 0.9 mm more lift and 12 degrees more duration
Throttle body increased from 60-64mm
Radius on some intake pipes increased from 70-80mm
Increased exhaust flow
Exhaust Head pipe increased frm 60-65mm
Higher flow catalytic converter
Main (single) exhaust pipe increased from 54-57mm
Rear (twin) pipes increased in diameter from 42.5 to 45mm
Block improvements:
Additional air passages in crankcase for reduced pumping losses
Other
Stronger connecting rods
New crankshaft with more counterbalance weight
Revised pistons with more valve-piston clearance


K24A3
Found in:
2003-2007 Honda Accord (Europe(EDM)) and Japan(JDM)) and 2003-2007 Honda Accord Euro CL9 (Australia, New Zealand)
Displacement: 2,354 cc (143.6 cu in)
Bore and Stroke: 87 mm x 99 mm (3.43 x 3.90 inches)
Compression: 10.5:1
Power: 189 hp (140 kW) @ 6800 rpm
Torque: 164.5 ft·lbf (223;N·m) @ 4500rpm
VTEC Engagement: 6000rpm
Redline: 7400rpm

[phunkmasterd]

Not knowing anything about compression ratios... what compression ratio pistons should i be looking to buy?

[G.]

Mine is an A2. I'll check my notes and see what CR I'm running.

[haggis]

my advice....don't listen to wikipedia, or americans

also, if you're chasing high HP...whats the point in building a Frankenstein K20/24? surely the only advantage of a K24 bottom end is that you gain extra torque and driveability without having to rev the tits off it?

you could whack a turbo onto the K20 and see 380-400bhp safely

[phunkmasterd]

yeah i could whack a turbo on it if something in the bottom of my K20 hadnt gone, so why replace it with a K20 when i cna get a K24...then turbo that at a later date

[G.]

Because. Some of us don't want to just bolt on a turbo or charger. Unless you ar trying to go as fast as you can down the drag strip. Then drivability is the important factor. For daily or track. And some of us just like a good strong na motor. Variety is the spice of life baby.

[haggis]

Because. Some of us don't want to just bolt on a turbo or charger. Unless you ar trying to go as fast as you can down the drag strip. Then drivability is the important factor. For daily or track. And some of us just like a good strong na motor. Variety is the spice of life baby.

yes, but he's said he's chasing figures already!

i didn't realise the bottom end on your k20 had gone though

that said, with the JRSC, i find my car infinitely better to drive in all aspects...more low down torque about the town and plenty of power up top for harder driving :bigthumb:

[phunkmasterd]

No where have i mentioned chasing power figures??!

I have mentioned rev limits so that i can over engineer the engine so i wont get another failure. I already have 240bhp and a fair old lump of torque but i use the car everyday but I dont drive like miss daisy and im regularly found around the 8000+ rpm mark.

I dont want to do the standard bolt on a supercharger route, its boring and been done to death, if i would do anything it would be a sidewinder turbo kit as then i get all the benefits (i wouldnt stick a giant turbo on it).

If you consider the power i was out putting i want to make sure i will have more and still be able to enjoy a large v-tec range without blowing up my engine (rpms).. otherwise i'd keep my 350bhp impreza and just fix that up.

Modifying cars is about the individual touch, the strive to be different, if i wanted all out speed i'd just buy a bike and kill myself at 180mph, of course it needs to be drivable as my ctr does 70 miles a day (and thats just to work and back), so i feel this is a happy medium. I believe that by spending less than a Rotrex or a Jackson Racing Charger I can have just as much power without the whine or the insurance hike... then and if the moment comes around stick a turbo on the Frankenstein

I appreciate in the post it doesnt say my bottom end had gone so dont take this as a moan at you, i just want to make the reason for the route I have chosen clear to all :bigthumb:

[pulpmelon_r]

http://www.kmodperformance.com/KMOD-K24 ... locks.html

Take a look at the Stage 1 or 2 short motors

[phunkmasterd]

good link, but i think i can do it for less. the only issue i have is setting my k-pro back to a base map

[Sincx]

http://www.kmodperformance.com/KMOD-K24 ... locks.html

Take a look at the Stage 1 or 2 short motors

Can one explain me the differences in power / torque figures or reliability between the NA stage 1,2,3,4 ? :scratch:

[conalmcn]

http://www.kmodperformance.com/KMOD-K24 ... locks.html

Take a look at the Stage 1 or 2 short motors

Can one explain me the differences in power / torque figures or reliability between the NA stage 1,2,3,4 ? :scratch:

N/A needs high compression, but the higher the cr the higher the octane required to keep things safe. Stage 1 would be your basic k24 standard bottom end just freshened up. Stage 2 is bored out slightly and has a higher compression ratio than standard (12.5), will make more power due to cr and bigger bore but revving high still not safe due to standard rods and pump. Stage 3 is 1mm bored, it also has the high compression pistons and (12.5) and forged rods so will take revving better also has better oil pump for revving higher. stage 4 is basically stage 3 designed with a higher compression piston, a high octane fuel would be required to run safely.

[andy18s]

good link, but i think i can do it for less. the only issue i have is setting my k-pro back to a base map

That's easy bit, don't worry about that... I'll even throw you one of my maps to get you started.

Like mentioned any k24 sub you can get your hands on with updated rods and the new tsx pistons (11:1 comp) will be a winner.

Would also recommend getting uprated injectors as the standard 310's will be maxed.

For a cheap oem alternative look at the Acura RDX injectors... They cheap And really good;)

[phunkmasterd]

good link, but i think i can do it for less. the only issue i have is setting my k-pro back to a base map

That's easy bit, don't worry about that... I'll even throw you one of my maps to get you started.

Like mentioned any k24 sub you can get your hands on with updated rods and the new tsx pistons (11:1 comp) will be a winner.

Would also recommend getting uprated injectors as the standard 310's will be maxed.

For a cheap oem alternative look at the Acura RDX injectors... They cheap And really good;)

That would be really cool, im going to get an automatic K24A3 (full engine) then get uprated rods and pistons from the US, convert it to manual (is it difficult?).

Will the new injectors fit the fuel rail?

[haggis]

That would be really cool, im going to get an automatic K24A3 (full engine) then get uprated rods and pistons from the US, convert it to manual (is it difficult?).

its only the gearbox that's different....the blocks are the same between autos and manuals

[andy18s]

TBH, if you getting a k24a3 motor, unless it has ridiculously high mileage, I wouldn't even bother replacing the rods and pistons.

You then bolt your head k20a2 head on, fit the k20a2 oil pump and sump, fit the k20 crank pulley, switch out your knock sensor and crank sensor, fit your k20 clutch, flywheel and gearbox and bobs your uncle. You would need the crv side mount as well. While you there you could replace valve stem seals, etc etc.

With good breathing mods you looking at about 280bhp at the fly with oodles of torque.

Built = slightly more horsepower and pointless high revving and frequent rebuilds.

OEM= still loads of power and honda reliability with a rev limit of 7800 which is more than enough :salut:

For the RDX injectors you'll need the Toyota clips... if you hunt around there are a couple of places in the US that sell the complete kit with injectors, clips and pigtails for $200.

[phunkmasterd]

TBH, if you getting a k24a3 motor, unless it has ridiculously high mileage, I wouldn't even bother replacing the rods and pistons.

You then bolt your head k20a2 head on, fit the k20a2 oil pump and sump, fit the k20 crank pulley, switch out your knock sensor and crank sensor, fit your k20 clutch, flywheel and gearbox and bobs your uncle. You would need the crv side mount as well. While you there you could replace valve stem seals, etc etc.

With good breathing mods you looking at about 280bhp at the fly with oodles of torque.

Built = slightly more horsepower and pointless high revving and frequent rebuilds.

OEM= still loads of power and honda reliability with a rev limit of 7800 which is more than enough :salut:

For the RDX injectors you'll need the Toyota clips... if you hunt around there are a couple of places in the US that sell the complete kit with injectors, clips and pigtails for $200.

This is something i have never understood? how is Honda OEM better than say Eagle Pistons and JE Rods?
Why would a built motor be pointless, im thinking of changing the valve stems, retainers etc and more aggressive cams... should i still go OEM?

I'd like to be able to rev much higher than required simply on a safety aspect... i will get hunting for the engine mount and injectors etc

[Sincx]

TBH, if you getting a k24a3 motor, unless it has ridiculously high mileage, I wouldn't even bother replacing the rods and pistons.

You then bolt your head k20a2 head on, fit the k20a2 oil pump and sump, fit the k20 crank pulley, switch out your knock sensor and crank sensor, fit your k20 clutch, flywheel and gearbox and bobs your uncle. You would need the crv side mount as well. While you there you could replace valve stem seals, etc etc.

With good breathing mods you looking at about 280bhp at the fly with oodles of torque.

Built = slightly more horsepower and pointless high revving and frequent rebuilds.

OEM= still loads of power and honda reliability with a rev limit of 7800 which is more than enough :salut:

For the RDX injectors you'll need the Toyota clips... if you hunt around there are a couple of places in the US that sell the complete kit with injectors, clips and pigtails for $200.

This is something i have never understood? how is Honda OEM better than say Eagle Pistons and JE Rods?
Why would a built motor be pointless, im thinking of changing the valve stems, retainers etc and more aggressive cams... should i still go OEM?

I'd like to be able to rev much higher than required simply on a safety aspect... i will get hunting for the engine mount and injectors etc

2nd that, if you upgrade all the OEM parts isn't that build to last, higher quality and fit and forget ?

But ye 280 isch bhp, loads of torque seems like ideal setup for having good fun on track. More so then with a SC on although that's damned nice setup to run as well.

[pulpmelon_r]

Honda OEM parts are bought from companies under contract and are subject to very strict quality control and testing proceedures.

Aftermarket companies are not. Simples.