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[karl]

The tide does appear to be turning, with several current models lighter than the cars they replaced. Still porky, but less so.

Which ones though mate? I mean in terms of the interesting cars which are affordable to the masses.

370z :cooldude:

previous gen Spec C Scoob :cooldude:

[karl]

The tide does appear to be turning, with several current models lighter than the cars they replaced. Still porky, but less so.

Which ones though mate? I mean in terms of the interesting cars which are affordable to the masses.

370z :cooldude:

previous gen Spec C Scoob :cooldude:

FN2....no wait....

[EvoStu]

The tide does appear to be turning, with several current models lighter than the cars they replaced. Still porky, but less so.

Which ones though mate? I mean in terms of the interesting cars which are affordable to the masses.

370z :cooldude:

Is that because you couldn't find the Stevie Wonder gif? The 370Z is ugly as sin!

[karl]

so's Renee Zellweger, but she's still lighter this year than last, the question was weight, not looks

[EvoStu]

so's Renee Zellweger, but she's still lighter this year than last, the question was weight, not looks

But she looks worse for losing weight and probably doesn't handle as well.

[Ali]

Problem is the cost of materials used to lighten cars usually means the end product is more expensive. On one hand they giveth and with the other they take'th away. As we've seen in Autocar when they've weighed and tested cars, claims on both emissions and weights are sometimes far from correct. Its all arse!

To use one of your own examples Stu, the price of the new Astra! And who'd have thought a Renault hot hatch would cost £25k, but a Megane RS250 in Sport guise but Cup suspension does. If manufacturers want us to pay that level of cash for normal cars, they better start offering us better engineering!

As for Alfa, I still have hope for them. Alfa UK seem to be putting some effort into dealers, at least. Our local franchise that I despised (a certain Mr. Clark) now has a decent rival as a former Saab dealer has changed to exclusively selling Alfa. They're never going to rival Japanese reliability, unless they start building them in Japan, but last years least reliable fleet car with the most faults per car and the most time spent off the road? The Audi A5! Just shows how good marketing can fool the middle classes...

[EvoStu]

And what about the new Porsche 918?

Would you pay for an Alfa with your own money though?

[Ali]

The 918 looks amazing. But I wonder what it sounds like....

And I might, you never know. Although Alfas come in the lower 1/3 of the reliability survey, most of the faults are now minor niggles. They are pretty good for lack of engine faults....though that category was led by *gulp* Subaru with 7% of cars. Alfa beat Audi, Jag, Land Rover and Jeep/Chrysler, yet I bet the owners of those probably think "I'm glad I didn't buy an Alfa" as they wait for roadside recovery....

[EvoStu]

The 918 looks amazing. But I wonder what it sounds like....

And I might, you never know. Although Alfas come in the lower 1/3 of the reliability survey, most of the faults are now minor niggles. They are pretty good for lack of engine faults....though that category was led by *gulp* Subaru with 7% of cars. Alfa beat Audi, Jag, Land Rover and Jeep/Chrysler, yet I bet the owners of those probably think "I'm glad I didn't buy an Alfa" as they wait for roadside recovery....

Definitely the future as long as they can keep the cost down.

Until Alfa has Skoda like reliability (who'd have ever thought someone would type that?) I wouldn't ever think of parting with my own money on one.

[smartie]

I would take a punt on an Alfa, the new hot hatch one just looks awesome.

[Gravy]

+1

... and I feel like owning an Alfa is something I need to do ... a completely wrong de passage, if you will.

[EvoStu]

+1

... and I feel like owning an Alfa is something I need to do ... a completely wrong de passage, if you will.

So is going with a fit hooker in Amsterdam apparently but are the risks and cost worth it?

[smartie]

Buy an Alfa and risk niggling faults, buy a Honda and risk rusting and paint issues, buy a Toyota and risk driving into a wall........

[sjw]

+1

... and I feel like owning an Alfa is something I need to do ... a completely wrong de passage, if you will.

So is going with a fit hooker in Amsterdam apparently but are the risks and cost worth it?

Up the wrong passage?

[Ali]

Buy an Alfa and risk niggling faults, buy a Honda and risk rusting and paint issues, buy a Toyota and risk driving into a wall........

Buy an Audi and risk owning the least reliable car of 2009 and looking like a smug c*nt

Alfa are never going to have top marks though, not while they're built in Italy, but that's part of the charm. They're certainly far less likely to leave you stuck on a grass verge with nothing to do but look at the pretty styling than they ever were, and no more than a Subaru is, if the exploding STIs of the past years are anything to go by, or the RX8 for that matter. Most people's car prejudices are formed when they were younger so people of our generation still think Honda are reliable and VWs are well built. Neither is probably true nowadays.

So yes, I'd consider an Alfa again if the right one came along. And the Alfa Giulietta (just how cool is that name) has been engineered for 4wd for the GTA version so you never know. In fact, the MiTo GTA looks like being a complete hoot and the suprmini hot hatch to beat. It'll give a lot of the next class up a huge headache with a proper diff and 240bhp in a car that weighs 1200kg.

[sjw]

a proper diff and 240bhp in a car that weighs 1200kg.

I heard there was no market for that kind of thing?

The problem I have with the Mito is that in the press photos they look like this:



But for some reason, on the road they look more like this:



I don't know whether they pick their camera angles carefully, or whether the photographs are of the cars with the lowest suspension and biggest wheels, or whether they take the photos with a couple of sacks of cement in the boot, but in the flesh they look a bit bloated and blobby.

[J]

You will only ever buy one Alfa. You will only ever want one Alfa. You will only ever be able to afford one Alfa.

[mc36155]

Hybrids are a dead end Stu. A stop gap until the whole CO2 nonsense is finally debunked, or a stop gap until hydrogen becomes the default fuel if the current moronic blind panic about [s]the sun being more active[/s] global warming continues. They're overly complicated and the weight of the extra equipment and batteries completely negates any possible fuel saving in the real world. But, they give a fake lower CO2 level on government window stickers in the showroom so the gullible masses will think they're being green and not realise that the massive increase in battery production results in massive increases in strip mines like this:









Welcome to the future. Fake environmentalism FTW

Welcome to the future?? smell the coffee! providing material for hybrid batteries is at the moment an infinitesimal end use for mining products, fact is the only reason we talk about this is to nullify the green argument. The other 95% of the car also comes from a hole in the ground located in another far flung region of the world, so who gives a sh#t. just replacing one part of the car that is mined for another part that is mined. The amount of exotic rare earth elements that are in every day items from mobile phones to computers all of which will have similarly or more controversial processing methods as do these batteries , but we all ignore this because we do not care or do not want to raise the subject, who wants to give up their iphone. but ofcause, in this case it helps our argument, and makes us all sound clever and informed.

frankly this is a similar mentality to people who do not like to think where their leg of lamb came from, clues in the name guys, and just like to think it was gifted by god in shrink wrap plastic.

honestly, take a look around you and how many things do you use to facilitate your daily business that can be grown in a field (im hoping your not a green grocer, lol)?? if it can not be grown it must be mined.

PS, that national geographic pic would be an awsome place for a paintball sesh.

[Gravy]

New Zealand lamb doesn't market itself as being the saviour of teh polar bears though, does it?

[Gravy]

+1

... and I feel like owning an Alfa is something I need to do ... a completely wrong de passage, if you will.

Oh ffs, will you feckin' grammar and spelling nazis get fookin' real with the filter?!?!?! :bad-words:

"rite de passage" it should have read