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My 2008 FN2 under the knife.Update: short shifter install.

Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:35 pm
by culasse
Driving around in my CTR for a couple of months now. love every minute of it, but there is room for improvement. Especially when you look at the inlet side of the engine. There are some CAI setups available, but they seem to lack at some point in the rev range. While you can gain some BHP up top, driveability can suffer below 4000 rpm. One reason for this is the k20z4 engine is running pig rich with average air/fuel ratios between 13-12:1. This was done as a safety precaution to keep the engine from melting a piston at high revs in the unlikely event of a lean burn mode.

Ik was never happy with the way these CAI systems function, so I set about figuring out how to improve the induction setup of the engine. I spent a good deal of time experimenting with my diy induction setup and I think I have it worked out.
In short, the desigin of the stock airbox is a disaster.
It`s a box with a panelfilter sandwhiched in between where the engine sucks the air from. This air becomes turbulent after it passes the filter and is immediately drawn through the mass airflow sensor (maf). The maf is one of the main sensors controlling the right amount of fuel delivered to the air the engine gets.
There are two problems with this system:
-The turbulent air makes it difficult for the maf to measure it correctly. Especially under heavy loads the air passes so quickly through the maf tube that the sensor cannot keep up with it. It constantly tries to correct for the right air/fuel ratio but when it falls ouside the stoichiometric range of 11-15.5:1, it compensates by changing to full rich mixture.
- Turbulent air in the maf tube can become so violent that ignition timing is reduced by one or more degrees, as a safety precaution, but with additional loss of power as a result.

I decided to make a modified induction setup giving the engine stable air/fuel ratios (AFR), improving driveability and give better performance.
Suspecting most of the gains were to be found in the maf I searched the web and learned that Subaru Impreza turbo`s had maf also. Some tuners had figured out how to modify their maf, leaning out the fuel curve, allowing the car to run better.
I took some bits of information here and there and used it to modify the maf tube of the k20 engine.
Below are some random pictures of my mods.

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I started by cutting the maf tube of the airfiltercover


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These are the parts for my induction setup. There is also a 75mm pvc tube for connecting the maf to the filter but is not shown.


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The key factor getting the engine measuring the correct afr without going to lean lies in the correct modification of the inside of the maf.
By trial and error I managed to find the correct shape of the tube`s inside contours resulting in a stable, and at the same time leaner afr signal from the mass airflow sensor.

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The panelfilter is being replaced by an open filter with radiused curves inside. The air being drawn inside is forced by the radiuses into a laminair flowing airstream pointed directly at the mass airflow sensor inside. This clean flowing airstream enhances the afr stability and provides maximum ignition advance for better power.
The Apexi dry filter is rated amongst the best among èm. But it is a bit pricey.
There are a few alternatives:
-Air dynamik
-Fujita
These filters do their job.


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Inside of the maf with filter and mass airflow sensor attached.


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In order to monitor my afr reading from the modified maf I decided to invest in a afr meter. But the exhaust had to come of the car in order to fit the bung for the lambda widebandsensor. It turned out that the downpipe consists of an inner-and outer tube, the outer tube`s diameter measures 70 mm, the inner tube 60mm.


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The header bolts were done up so ridiculously tight, it was a matter of time before we knackered them. I had to fetch another pair. Take care not to strip the threads from the header collector eyes.


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This is an overlay of the afr readouts taken from my afr meter of an fn2 with stock airbox and my modified induction setup. The dotted lines represent the modded induction.
Purple= afr curve
red=throttle
green=torque
blue=horsepower
black=rpm
In stock form the afr curve sharply falls off into the 13:1 region, at the same time retarding ignition timing, holding back torque during acceleration mode.
With modified setup torque curve is higher througout the powerband up to 5200 where vtec sets in.
The improved airflow from the maf tube together with stable afr signal allowes the vtc system to induce higher gasspeeds. At idle, vtc is zero degrees, afr can be as high as 15.5:1. In acceleration mode vtc kicks in, steadily increasing valve overlap to a maximum of 50 degrees at approximately 5200rpm where vtec is gradually taking over.
Note that this setup leans the engine out by a full point, improving torque and bhp throughout the rev range compared to stock.

I must point out that this readout is not from my car, it`s from a customer of mine who was trying out his setup. I also borrowed him my afr meter, but he didn`t found it necessary callibrating the torque, bhp parameters for true representation. Hence no real world torque and horsepower reading, except for the fact that the curve overlay shows the difference between stock and modified. The afr curves however are callibrated for true readout.
My own car already has some further mods, making a direct comparison between stock and modified inconsistent.


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My increased torque output necessitated stiffer engine mounts to keep the engine from rocking back and forth under load. I took the upper and lower mounts and filled the holes in the rubber big end bearing with some chunks of rubber and poured some polyurethane glue over it. Works pretty well and as a bonus, shifting improved too.


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My Innovate motorsports lc1 controller with Bosch lsu4.2 wideband lambdasensor. An invaluable aid for monitoring afr on the engine.

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I couldn`t get the lower airfilterbox off, so I left it in place.

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Above are some pictures taken during the time I was constantly experimenting with my setup, so everything was temporarily fixed with tie wraps.
I found a piece of metal bar in my garage and sawed/filed it in shape so it would support the maf and filter.

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As far as I`m concerned you can remove the insulation mat attached under the bonnet. It serves no function at all. This way, more air will find its way into the engine compartment. The bonnet is specially shaped so that it allows an airstream over the top of the engine and behind it, taking the warm air from the exhaust manifold with it and disperses it through the opening in the undertray underneath the car.


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The grille area is completely sealed by a plate behind it and will not pass any air into the engine bay. I cut some holes in the mounting plate for the grille, allowing cool air to cool the intake manifold, injectors, fuel rail as well as providing more air for the filter. In the process I removed the intake manifold cover aswell, as I believe it can contribute to heatsoak on warm days/city driving.

Up until now I`m very pleased with the way my car drives know. With this modified intake setup I have experienced the following results:
-More torque/horsepower throughout a wider powerband. Because of the leaner condition my engine runs in, I think I have traded in a few top end horsepower, but gained substantially more in the midrange where it counts.
This is all subjective, totally based on arse dyno. I have not had the car on the rollers yet, don`t really believe in them as readings can be rather inconsistent.
-Mpg improvement because of the leaner afr. Engine warms up very quick, due to the catalytic converter reaching closed loop operating temperature faster.
-Driveability greatly improved, less bogging, better throttle response. Very smooth idle and acceleration pickup. No heatsoak noticed.
-Sound rivals any aftermarket CAI. Because the open filter is placed directly under the cowl it amplifies the typical engine wail. The vtc system gives an agressive growl, with a noticeable change in tone when vtec takes over, then it`s LOUD.
Yet in daily traffic the engine is whispering at idle and runs smooth an quiet like any stock FN2.

I`m still not done with my car. In the meantime I have found a few things that can be improved. When I have the time I will post an update. B.t.w excuse my lousy English, I`m doing my best.
Enjoy, Paul

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:50 pm
by burton
WOW! Great first post. seems someone is very handy when it comes to tuning and mechanicaly minded! alot of hard work there i guess. and your english is :thumbup:

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 9:28 pm
by Newannaive
great thread....keep us updated :thumbup:

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 12:01 am
by nunoctr
this is a "copy" of X's intake in the 8th generation civic forum.

Good with the bonet open. Very bad with the bonet close because of the heat.

In sumer day's you will lose BHP.

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 8:28 am
by culasse
nunoctr wrote:this is a "copy" of X's intake in the 8th generation civic forum.

Good with the bonet open. Very bad with the bonet close because of the heat.

In sumer day's you will lose BHP.
I have heard from this guy. Apparently he owns a Civic si and a Scooby sti. I wouldn`t be surprised if he took the lessons learned from modding the maf on his sti and putting them to good use on his Civic si.

Up until know I have racked up some 3300 km`s with this setup and I can report that it rides like a dream. The stock airbox doesn`t even come close. With the modifcations mentioned in my thread above, there is a constant stream of cool air entering the engine bay. No loss of power, no heatsoak. I taped a thermometer under the bonnet to record the temperatures. Indeed, when idling in stop and go traffic, there is a temperature rise, but the engine performs without a hiccup.

I forgot to add a few analog readouts. One is from stock airbox and the other is with my modified intake.
Please forget about the analog torque and horsepower figures, they were not callibrated at the time.
http://tinypic.com/2mphjmzc

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 9:01 am
by dandemoraliser
good read that mate, well done.

going take Mini-Bilko's mantel for techy bloke!

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 12:00 pm
by illeagalhunter
Not really a job for Joe Public . Well done

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 1:22 pm
by lukits01
gotta love DIY!
ahhaha Fortune Favors the Brave they say
Great idea with the airflow through the grill!
I might give it a go next weekend

Keep those ideas coming!

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 1:55 pm
by culasse
lukits01 wrote:gotta love DIY!
ahhaha Fortune Favors the Brave they say
Great idea with the airflow through the grill!
I might give it a go next weekend

Keep those ideas coming!
Thanks for the nice words. One word of caution; the plastic grille and its cover is rather brittle, you will easily break some of the clips when trying to disassemble everything.
I`m in complete awe of the modifications done to your car. At first I had similar plans with my car, but changed plans. I intend to keep it for a while and then probably trade it in for an S2000.

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 6:37 pm
by JohnnoTypeR
a good read and some class picture's fella.

Good to see people are doing modding Fn2's about time really.

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:14 am
by lukits01
culasse wrote: I`m in complete awe of the modifications done to your car. At first I had similar plans with my car, but changed plans. I intend to keep it for a while and then probably trade it in for an S2000.
LoL, side affect of chasing S2000 all day long ahaha
can't beat them, join them.
Maybe I'm in denial, I still believe I can beat them LoL

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:42 pm
by culasse
With the current outrageous prices for gas it`s a good feeling to know my intake mods improve MPG.

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Still not forgetting to vtec now and then. Even with the warm weather as of now, the car still drives flawless.

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:55 pm
by estornino
Good Job!
I think i'm going to take off the insulation mat attached under the bonnet too.

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 4:59 pm
by Bri_jnr
Good job!! interested to see it all set up!

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 5:04 pm
by culasse
Please do fellah. I heard rumors from people of some American forums saying that the heat from the engine could damage the paint on the bonnet, but I find that unlikely. If this were true you would see this appear everywhere in the engine bay.

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 9:06 am
by Drucifer
culasse wrote:....As far as I`m concerned you can remove the insulation mat attached under the bonnet. It serves no function at all....
Not entirely true. It melts and smothers flames if there is a fire in the engine bay and helps warm the engine quicker in colder months.

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 3:19 pm
by culasse
Only a couple of cars in this world have insulation under the bonnet. The rest do fine without them.
I do agree however when it comes to a coldstart in the winter.

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 11:15 am
by FAT4Y
wow that is a great report..im glad to see sumone is mucking about twith their car..i mite do your grill intake part..

keep us posted..nice work :thumbup:

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife. (update)

Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 5:50 pm
by culasse
I`ve been busy trying out some further mods on my FN2.

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It`s possible to buy throttle body spacers for this car in Amerika. But with a pricetag of $120 I figured I could make my own.
I started out with a piece of teakwood and cut it out.

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Just some more filing and shaving to get it right.


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The throttle body has coolant running through it preventing the throttle blade from freezing and getting stuck on cold winter startup mornings. In summer it tends to heat up the air passing through the throttle body, so I capped it off. I connected the coolant in-and outletlines with each other using a small tube. In the photo on the left below I used the other coolant line to block off the ports on the throttle body. The remaining coolant needs to be blown out. It tastes gastly, b.t.w.

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Throttle body removed from inlet manifold.

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Note the buildup of olie/dirt in the throttle body. Honda decided to connect several breather tubes on the inlet tube close to the throttle body.

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Even more oily gunk is to be found inside the inlet manifold, undoubtedly blow out from the pcv valve. In this photo you can see the trumpets fitted in the plenum. Because of its three piece construction, it is theoretically possible to remove the trumpets and replace them by longer or shorter ones.

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Because of the spacer, the original studs are too short and need to be replaced by longer ones.

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As luck would have it, I discovered a long piece of threaded stud in my toolbox. I cut it to length and it fitted perfectly

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Every time I was working on my car, I got irritated by this piece of tubing. I constantly bruised or cut my hands on it.
Eventually I ditched it.

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I decided to install the external oil catch system from my old 106 GTI on my FN2. It is just a temporary fix. I connected the breather lines from the cylinderhead and intake manifold to it to see if it will collect the crap from the engine. I had another vacuüm catch tank on my tuned 106 GTI to connect between the pcv valve and manifold, but unfortunately it was broken. This system worked very well however, hardly any buildup inside the GTI engine. I might make another vacuüm tank for the Honda.

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This is how the throttle body looks installed. According to some American forums, this spacer is worth circa 1 or 2 WHP. Personally I am more interested in throttle response. After some driving I can place my hand on the throttle body, feels warm instead of hot. Hence a cooler charge of air through the throttle body. Haven`t had the opportunity to take the car for a long trip up untill know, seems to pull better in the midrange though.

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The clutch pedal has an adjusting mechanism. It helped me setting up the clutch engagement for flatshifts.

With these mods the car is going really well at the moment. I intend to keep it in this state of tune at the moment.
Have ordered some lightweight wheels and tyres, hope they arrive soon.

Re: My 2008 FN2 under the knife.

Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 10:38 pm
by mw1978
culasse

I have this TB spacer with gaskets
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